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I've been trying to find out if I can apply the MVC architecture to procedural and how I can go about implementing this into my code. From my understanding MVC basically represents the separation of the business logic, presentational layer and other logic although it always seems to be aimed at OO-PHP in particular.
Can you recommend the best way to approach MVC within a procedural context??
Thanks.
MVC is OO pattern and you want to approach it with a procedural context.
This is plain wrong. MVC has nothing to do with object oriented coding.
MVC is a software architecture pattern which aims at separating the representation of information from the user's interaction with it.
How you achieve that is up to you. You can achieve that using whatever coding form you want, object oriented, procedural, functional, and what not.
With regard to the question at hand: The easiest way to achieve the MVC pattern when you're coding procedural PHP is to use a lot of small functions where each particular function has its own unique task. Don't let a function have many tasks. That way it is more easy to separate things. Also don't keep a lot of functions in the same file. Rather gather related functions together in smaller groups each group in its own file (what actually is done in OO with classes).
Someone does it here with a simple example, MVC without OO: http://www.fluffycat.com/PHP-Design-Patterns/Non-OO-MVC/
Yep, that about sums up MVC... but it doesn't have to be object oriented... you just need to follow a few golden rules:
The controller receives and processes input, generates any data and puts it in the model.
The view takes data from the model and renders it.
The controller should not format data for view - it should have no knowledge of how/why/what the view wants (eg doesn't insert HTML in a text string since the output could be JSON)
The view should not look-up any data for itself - if it's not in the model then the controller failed in it's job (throw/report an error).
Beyond that you can do things however you want. You'd basically need a set of procedures to act as controllers - parsing $_REQUEST vars (more likely as GET/POST/COOKIE) performing any data lookup building + filling the model, and then another set of procedures that at as views - taking what's in the model and rendering it for the user. The model can be as simple as an associative array.
Absolutely. Use any combination of the following:
Use include files.
Use functions.
Separate your source files.
Divide sections of your code within source files.
Use code blocks (curly braces).
Separate PHP and/or HTML and/or JS files.
Anything that organizes your code more along the lines of Models, Views, and Controllers. It may not be "pure" or "correct" MVC in some people's minds...but if it organizes your procedural code more meaningfully or teaches you more about MVC, then it's a good thing.
This is kinda weird.
MVC is OO pattern and you want to approach it with a procedural context.
The first thing that comes to my mind is to have some kind of templating engine in order to split the PHP from the HTML code. This will be one big step towards procedural MVC :)
The next thing is to name functions of the same group (that means, functions that contains logic for related objects) with prefixes (like you group methods under a class name).
For example - look PHP procedural functions for working with mysql :
mysql_connect()
mysql_real_escape_string();
mysql_select_db();
mysql_query();
etc.
And group those functions in separate files. This will help to decouple a bit of the logic too.
If anything else come to my mind, i'll edit my post :)
If you are implementing a new design pattern you most likely are refactoring or writing something from scratch. I highly recommend moving to OOP if you plan to use MVC. It could be implemented procedurally but will be very hackish and not a good solution.
There are several free MVC php solutions that you can pick up easily. Here are a few:
Zend Framework
Kohana
Code Ignighter
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Why should I use templating system in PHP?
I was just curious as to how many developers actually do this?
Up to this time I haven't and I was just curious to whether it really helps make things look cleaner and easier to follow. I've heard using template engines like Smarty help out, but I've also heard the opposite. That they just create unnecessary overhead and it's essentially like learning a new language.
Does anyone here have experience with templates? What are your feelings on them? Are the helpful on big projects or just a waste of time?
On a side note: The company I work for doesn't have a designer, there are just two developers working on this project charged with the re-design/upgrade. I also use a bit of AJAX, would this have issues with a template engine?
Not only does this practice make the code look cleaner, it also has many long term and short term benefits.
You can never go wrong with organizing code. First off it makes it much easier to maintain and easier to read if someone else has to pick up after you. I have worked with Smarty before and it is nice, it keeps the designers work from interfering with the program code.
Using template systems and frameworks would make it much easier to accomplish tasks. There is a rule of thumb you can follow which is DRY (Don't Repeat Yourself). Frameworks help you achieve this goal.
You may want to look into MVC, this is the model that these frameworks are based off of. But you could implement this design structure without necessarily using framework. Avoiding the learning curve. For frameworks like Zend, the learning curve is much greater than some other ones.
I have found that Code Igniter is fairly easy to use and they have some VERY helpful video tutorials on their website.
Best of Luck!!
Actually it's the business logic that needs to be separated from the views. You can use php as a "template language" inside the views.
You can use ajax on any template engine i think.
Edit
My original response addressed the question whether to use a template engine or not to generate your html.
I argued that php is good enough for template tasks, as long as you separate business logic from presentation logic.
It's worth doing this even for simple pages, because it enables you to:
isolate the code that is the brain of your application from the code that is the face, and so you can change the face, without messing with the brain, or you can enhance the brain without braking the looks
isolate 80% of bugs in 20% of your code
create reusable components: you could assign different presentation code to the same business code, and vice versa;
separate concerns of the feature requests (business code) from the concerns of the design requests (presentation code), which also usually are related to different people on the client side, and different people on the contractor side
use different people to write the business code and the presentation code; you can have the designer to handle directly the presentation code, with minimal php knoledge;
A simple solution, which mimics MVC and doesn't use objects could be:
use a single controller php file, which receives all requests via a .httpdaccess file;
the controller decides what business and presentation code to use, depending on the request
the controller then uses an include statement to include the business php file
the business code does it's magic, and then includes the presentation php file
PHP is a template engine (or if you prefer, a hypertext preprocessor). When HTML is mixed heavily with PHP logic, it does become very difficult to maintain, which is why you would have functions defined separately to build various parts and simply build the page from short function calls embedded in the HTML. Done like this, I don't see much of a difference between Smarty and raw PHP, other than the choice of delimiters.
Separation of concerns is a very important tenant to any type of software development, even on the web. Too many times I have found that people just throw everything into as few files as possible and call it a day. This is most certainly the wrong way to do it. As has been mentioned, it will help with maintainability of the code for others, but more than that, it helps you be able to read the code. When everything is separated out, you can think about easily.
Code Ignitor, I have found, has been the easiest to learn framework for working with PHP. I pretty much started my current job and was up and running with it within a few days, from never having heard of it, to using it pretty efficiently. I don't see it as another language at all, either. Basically, using the framework forces me to organize things in a manageable way, and the added functionality is anlagous to using plugins and such for jQuery, or importing packages in Java. The thought that it's like learning another language seems almost silly.
So, in short, organize organize organize. Keep in mind, though, that there is a level of abstraction that just becomes absurd. A rule of thumb is that a class (or file in our case) should do one thing very well. This doesn't mean it is a class that wraps around print, but takes a string, formats it using a complex algorithm and then prints it (this is just an example). Each class should do something specific, and you can do that without any framework. What makes MVC great, though, is that it lets you organize things further, not just on the single class level, but on the level of "packages", being Model, View, and Controller (at least in the case of these frameworks; there are other ways to package projects). So, now you have single classes that do things well, and then you have them grouped with similar classes that do other things well. This way, everything is kept very clean an manageable.
The last level to think about once you have things organized into classes, and then packages, is how these classes get accessed between packages. When using MVC, the access usually will go Model<->Controller<->View, thus separating the model (which is usually database stuff and "business" code in the PHP world), from the view (which usually takes information from the user, and passes it along to the controller, who will then get more information from the model, if necessary, or do something else with the input information). The controller kind of works like the switchboard between the two other packages usually. Again, there are other ways to go with packaging and such, but this is a common way.
I hope that helps.
Smarty and other php template frameworks really do nothing more than compile to PHP anyway, and they also cache their results in most cases to allow for faster processing. You can do this all on your own, but if you ever look at the compiled templates that Smarty generates, and compare to the original Smarty template you create, you can see that one is far more readable than the other.
I write mostly mod_perl these days and started using templates (HTML::Template) halfway through our ongoing project. If I had to make the decision again, I would use templates right from the start - rewriting later to use templates is kind of tedious, though rewarding because you get nicer and cleaner code. For anything bigger than 2-3 pages in php, I would also use some template engine.
One big advantage of a templating engine such as Smarty is that non-developers can use it to embed the necessary logic that is used on the front-end (one really can't separate logic and display on all but the simplest sites). However, if the developer is the one maintaining the pages then using PHP would be preferable in my opinion.
If you separate out large logic blocks and maintain a consistent patten for looping and for-each flow control statements (i.e. don't use print statements, or only use print statements for one-liners, etc.) Then that should be okay.
Ok, have a bunch of questions that I have been thinking about the past few days. Currently I have a site that is just a bunch of PHP files with MySQL statements mixed in with PHP, HTML and CSS, basically a huge mess. I have been tasked with cleaning up the site and have made for myself, the following requirements:
The site needs to be efficient and well laid out (the source code), I would like to be able to write as little code as possible.
There has to be good separation between structure, presentation and logic.
For whatever reason, I can't use a framework and need to keep the code maintainable and "simple" as there will be future developers working with it.
There needs to be an admin section for at least a few pages.
Saying that, this is what I know about the site as it is now:
Consists of 10-12 pages, a few are completely static, most are dynamically driven via a database and there is a huge form for users to fill out (20-30 fields) that need to be validated and checked.
The hierarchy of the site is basically 5-6 main pages and then sub-pages within those.
So, knowing those things I wanted to know if anyone had any tips/suggestions as to how to go about doing this with the least amount of headaches.
Would an OO approach be best in this situation?
Since there are many static pages and the dynamic pages just need the content filled in would it be best to use some kind of basic template?
EDIT: Thanks for the answers, when I said no frameworks I basically meant anything that would require new syntax other than PHP, as whoever gets hired to work on this site after me will probably only know PHP.
Here's an article about how to organize your PHP project, from Rasmus Lerdorf, the architect who created the language:
http://toys.lerdorf.com/archives/38-The-no-framework-PHP-MVC-framework.html
Despite the popularity of OO frameworks for PHP, Rasmus advocates a less OO approach. He knows more than anyone about PHP intended usage, and how to take advantage of its architecture for high-performance websites.
edit: In response to the comment by #theman, I'll concede the article isn't a fine work of writing, but I think the content is important. Using PHP as it was intended to be used is better than struggling against its weaknesses to make it fit an OO mold.
I highly recommend the Smarty templating engine for all PHP projects. It gives you an easy way to separate the logic from the presentation.
Have a look at this SO question and the answer. It's a pretty good, simple MVC design with some tips on how it can be improved. If you are concerned about maintenance, then at the very least you need to seperate presentation from logic (you need a view and controller). Smarty forces that, but it is a type of framework and you'll have additional syntax to learn.
Before you jump on Rasmus' "no framework php mvc framework" bandwagon, read some of the critical comments. Any web application structure is a framework, and Rasmus' approach isn't the best I've seen.
I want to create a 100% object oriented framework in PHP with no procedural programming at all, and where everything is an object. Much like Java except it will be done in PHP.
Any pointers at what features this thing should have, should it use any of the existing design patterns such as MVC? How creating objects for every table in the database would be possible, and how displaying of HTML templates etc would be done?
Please don't link to an existing framework because I want to do this on my own mainly as a learning excercise. You will be downvoted for linking to an existing framework as your answer and saying 'this does what you want'.
Some features I'd like to have are:
Very easy CRUD page generation
AJAX based pagination
Ajax based form validation if possible, or very easy form validation
Sortable tables
Ability to edit HTML templates using PHP
I've gone through many of problems on your list, so let me spec out how I handle it. I am also OOP addict and find object techniques extremely flexible and powerful yet elegant (if done correctly).
MVC - yes, hands down, MVC is a standard for web applications. It is well documented and understandable model. Furthermore, it does on application level what OOP does on class level, that is, it keeps things separated. Nice addition to MVC is Intercepting Filter pattern. It helps to attach filters for pre- and post-processing request and response. Common use is logging requests, benchmarking, access checking, caching, etc.
OOP representation of database tables/rows is also possible. I use DAO or ActiveRecord on daily basis. Another approach to ORM issues is Row Data Gateway and Table Data Gateway. Here's example implementation of TDG utilising ArrayAccess interface.
HTML templates also can be represented as objects. I use View objects in conjunction with Smarty template engine. I find this technique EXTREMELY flexible, quick, and easy to use. Object representing view should implement __set method so every property gets propagated into Smarty template. Additionally __toString method should be implemented to support views nesting. See example:
$s = new View();
$s->template = 'view/status-bar.tpl';
$s->username = "John Doe";
$page = new View();
$page->template = 'view/page.tpl';
$page->statusBar = $s;
echo $page;
Contents of view/status-bar.tpl:
<div id="status-bar"> Hello {$username} </div>
Contents of view/page.tpl:
<html>
<head>....</head>
<body>
<ul id="main-menu">.....</ul>
{$statusBar}
... rest of the page ...
</body>
</html>
This way you only need to echo $page and inner view (status bar) will be automatically transformed into HTML. Look at complete implementation here. By the way, using one of Intercepting Filters you can wrap the returned view with HTML footer and header, so you don't have to worry about returning complete page from your controller.
The question of whether to use Ajax or not should not be important at time of design. The framework should be flexible enough to support Ajax natively.
Form validation is definitely the thing that could be done in OO manner. Build complex validator object using Composite pattern. Composite validator should iterate through form fields and assigned simple validators and give you Yes/No answer. It also should return error messages so you can update the form (via Ajax or page reload).
Another handy element is automatic translation class for changing data in db to be suitable for user interface. For example, if you have INT(1) field in db representing boolean state and use checkbox in HTML that results in empty string or "on" in _POST or _GET array you cannot just assign one into another. Having translation service that alters the data to be suitable for View or for db is a clean way of sanitizing data. Also, complexity of translation class does not litter your controller code even during very complex transformations (like the one converting Wiki syntax into HTML).
Also i18n problems can be solved using object oriented techniques. I like using __ function (double underscore) to get localised messages. The function instead of performing a lookup and returning message gives me a Proxy object and pre-registers message for later lookup. Once Proxy object is pushed into View AND View is being converted into HTML, i18n backend does look up for all pre-registered messages. This way only one query is run that returns all requested messages.
Access controll issues can be addressed using Business Delegate pattern. I described it in my other Stackoverflow answer.
Finally, if you would like to play with existing code that is fully object oriented, take look at Tigermouse framework. There are some UML diagrams on the page that may help you understand how things work. Please feel free to take over further development of this project, as I have no more time to work on it.
Have a nice hacking!
Now at the risk of being downvoted, whilst at the same time being someone who is developing their own framework, I feel compelled to tell you to at least get some experience using existing frameworks. It doesn't have to be a vast amount of experience maybe do some beginner tutorials for each of the popular ones.
Considering the amount of time it takes to build a good framework, taking the time to look into what you like and loathe about existing solutions will pale in comparison. You don't even need to just look at php frameworks. Rails, Django etc are all popular for a reason.
Building a framework is rewarding, but you need a clear plan and understanding of the task at hand, which is where research comes in.
Some answers to your questions:
Yes, it should probably use MVC as the model view controller paradigm translates well into the world of web applications.
For creating models from records in tables in your database, look into ORM's and the Active Record pattern. Existing implementations to research that I know of include Doctrine, more can be found by searching on here.
For anything AJAX related I suggest using jQuery as a starting point as it makes AJAX very easy to get up and running.
Creating your own framework is a good way to gain an appreciation for some of the things that might be going on under the hood of other frameworks. If you're a perfectionist like me, it gives you a good excuse to agonize over every little detail (e.g. is should that object be called X or Y, should I use a static method or an instance method for this).
I wrote my own (almost completely OO framework a while ago), so here's my advice:
If you've worked with other frameworks before, consider what you liked/didn't like and make sure yours gives you exactly what you want.
I personally love the MVC pattern, I wouldn't dream of doing a project without it. If you like MVC, do it, if you don't don't bother.
If you want to do JavaScript/AJAX stuff, do use a JavaScript library. Coding all your own JavaScript from scratch teaches you a bit about the DOM and JavaScript in general, but ultimately its a waste of time, focus on making your app/framework better instead.
If you don't want to adopt another framework wholesale, take a look at whether there are other open source components you like and might want to use, such as Propel, Smarty, ADOdb, or PEAR components. Writing your own framework doesn't necessarily mean writing everything from scratch.
Use design patterns where they make sense (e.g. singletons for database access perhaps), but don't obsess over them. Ultimately do whatever you think produces the neatest code.
Lastly, I learned a lot by delving into a bit of Ruby on Rails philosophy, You may never use RoR (I didn't), but some of the concepts (especially Convention over Configuration) really resonated with me and really influenced my thinking.
Ultimately, unless your needs are special most people will be more productive if they adopt an existing framework. But reinventing the wheel does teach you more about wheels.
At the risk of sounding glib, this seems to me like any other software project, in this sense:
You need to define your requirements clearly, including motivation and priorities:
WHY do this? What are the key benefits you hope to realize? If the answer is "speed" you might do one thing, if it's "ease of coding" you might do another, if it's "learning experience" you might do a thid
what are the main problems you're trying to solve? And which are most important? Security? Easy UI generation? Scalability?
The answer to "what features it should have" really depends on answers to questions like those above.
Here are my suggestions:
Stop what you're doing.
It's already been done to death.
Click this Zend Framework or that CakePHP or maybe even this Recess Framework.
Now, my reasons:
... if you've worked with developers at all, you've worked with developers that love reinventing the wheel for no good reason. This is a very, very common failure pattern.
... they would go off and write hundreds and thousands of the crappiest languages you could possibly imagine ...
... "Oh, I'm gonna create my own framework, create my own everything," and it's all gonna be crappier than stuff you could just go out and get ...
from StackOverflow Podcast # 3.
So, save yourself some time, and work on something that solves a problem for people like a web app that lets people automatically update Twitter when their cat's litter box needs cleaning. The problem of "Object Oriented PHP Framework" is done. Whatever framework you slap together will never be as reliable or useful or feature rich as any of the freely available, fully supported frameworks available TODAY.
This doesn't mean you can't have a learning experience, but why do it in the dark, creating a framework that will grow into a useless blob of code, leaving you without anything to show for your time? Develop a web app, something for people to use and enjoy, I think you'll find the experience incredibly rewarding and EDUCATIONAL.
Like Jim OHalloran said, writing your own framework gives you a very good insight into how other frameworks do things.
That said, I've written a data-access layer before that almost completely abstracted away any SQL. Application code could request the relevant object and the abstraction layer did lots of magic to fetch the data only when it was needed, didn't needlessly re-fetch, saved only when it was changed, and supported putting some objects on different databases. It also supported replicated databases, and respected replication lag, and had an intelligent collection object. It was also highly extensible: the core was parameter driven and I could add a whole new object with about 15 lines of code - and got all the magic for free.
I've also written a CRUD layout engine which was used for a considerable percentage of a site. The core was parameter driven so it could run list and edit pages for anything, once you wrote a parameter list. It automatically did pagination, save-new-delete support etc etc, leveraging the object layer above. It wasn't object-oriented in and of itself, but it could have been made so.
In other words, a object-oriented framework in PHP is not only possible, it can be very efficient. This was all in PHP 4, BTW, and I bumped up against what was possible with PHP 4 objects a couple of times. :-)
I never got as far as a central dispatch that called objects, but I wasn't far away. I've worked with several frameworks that do that, though, and the file layout can get hairy quickly. For that reason, I would go for a dispatch system that is only as complex as it needs to be and no more. A simple action/view (which is almost MVC anyway) should get you more than far enough.
I initially started creating my own framework with similar ideals to your own. However, after a couple of months I realised I was re-creating work that had been done many times over. In the end I found an open source framework which was easily extendable and used it as a basis for my own development.
The features I implemented myself:
MVC Architecture
Authentication object
Database access class
URL rewriting config
Pagination class
Email class
Encryption
The features I looked at and thought, forget it! I'll build on top of someone elses:
Caching class
Form validation class
FTP class
Plugin-ability classes
Of course, writing a framework that outperforms the open source options is possible, but why would you bother?
It's true that some developers reinvent the wheel for no good reason. But because there are already good frameworks around doesn't mean that it's a waste of time doing one yourself. I started on one a while ago with no intention of using it for anything more than an exercise. I highly recommend doing it.
I've got the perfect link for you my friend: http://nettuts.com/tutorials/php/creating-a-php5-framework-part-1/. This is an awesome tutorial I have looked at, and its not too overwhelming. Plus look around the PHP section of that site I saw an article on CRUD. As for the AJAX look elsewhere, but you have to start somewhere, and this tutorial is awesome.
Note: this tutorial has 3 parts and I think it brings up MVC in the second instalment, but starts the first part using other methods.
The one, huge selling point I would look for in a new framework is that it would make writing testable code easy.
We typically work with Zend Framework, and it's mostly awesome, but trying to unit test/test drive ZF-based code is not far short of masochism.
If you could provide a framework that replaces the MVC parts of ZF with something that allows us to write testable code, whilst still allowing us to use the library parts of ZF, I will - quite literally - buy you a beer.
I'll buy you two beers if you ditch the AJAX. There's a huge gulf between an OO PHP framework and a JavaScript framework.
Please don't link to an existing framework
I will not, I started writing my own for learning purposes, and took a peek into some of the mainstream frameworks, and even with my limited knowledge see so many mistakes and bad ideas in them.
They're built by hardcore developers, not end users.
I'm in no way saying I could write better than the "big boys" but I (along with most of you I imagine) could point out why some things they do are bad, even if just because they're not end user/non-developer friendly...
I wonder how your framework is doing, some 6 years on?
Are you still working on it? Did you stop?
Should You Write Your Own Framework
This is probably a little late for you, but for anyone else, writing your own framework is a fantastic thing to do for learning purposes.
If, however, you are wanting to write one other than learning purposes, because you cannot work out the one you are using, or because it's too bloated, then do not!
Believe me, and don't be insulted, you would not be here contemplating it if you are a knowledgeable enough developer to do so successfully!
Last year I wanted to learn OOP/classes, and more advanced PHP.
And writing my own framework was the best thing I did (am actually still doing), as I have learned so much more than I anticipated.
Along the way I've learned (to name a few):
OOP/Classes many best practices which come with it - such as
Dependency Injection, SRP
Design patterns, which help you write code and structure your system
in such a way that it makes many things logical and easy. For an
example see Wiki - SOLID
Namespaces
PHP Error Handling and all of the functionality which that provides
A more robust (and better) understanding of MVC, and how to apply it
appropriately (as there is no clear cut way to use it, just guides
and best practices).
Autoloading (of classes for OOP)
Better code writing style and more structured layout, and better
commenting skills
Naming conventions (it's fun making your own, even if based on
common practices).
And many other basic PHP things which you invariably come across accidentally from reading something.
All of this not only vastly improved my grasp of PHP and things which come with it, to a more advanced level, but also some of the commercially/widely used methods and principles.
And this all boosted my confidence in using PHP in general, which in turns makes it easier to learn.
Why Write a Framework To Learn All of This
When you start out, you learn the basics - A (variables), then B (how to write a basic function), etc.
But it doesn't take long when you're trying to learn more advanced things, that to learn and use D and E, you also have to learn and understand F, G, H, and J, and to know those you have to know K, L, and M, and to know parts of L and M you first need to understand N and O...
It becomes a minefield as trying to learn one thing brings the need to first learn a few other things, and those other things often bring a need to understand various other things.
And you end up a mile away from where you started, your mind tingling and shooting sparks from it, and about 20 tabs open all with various advanced PHP things, none of which you are 100% comfortable with.
But over time, with practice and most certainly dedication, it will all fit into place, and you'll look back at code, even a collection of files/classes, and think "Did I write that.."?
Writing a framework helped greatly with this "minefield" because:
I had specific tasks to do, which brought about the need to learn and
implement other things, but specific things. This allowed me to focus
on less things at once, and even when something branches off to
various other things, you can reel it back in to where you started
because you are working on something specific. You can do this with
any learning, but if you do not have some goal, or specific task you
are focusing on, you can easily get distracted and lost in the ether
of things to learn.
I had something practical to work with. Often reading tutorials about
an animal class, and how cat and dog classes extend animal etc,
can be confusing. When you have a real life task in your own
framework, such as how do I manage XYZ, then you can learn how
classes work easier because you have trial and error and a solid
requirement which you understand, because you created the
requirement! Not just theory-like reading which means nothing
usually.
I could put it down when my mind was blown, although as it was my
framework (my Frankenstein's monster in the beginning :P) I wanted to
press on, because it was interesting, and a personal goal to learn
and sort the next stage, to resolve an issue I was stuck with, etc.
You can do it how you want. It might not be best practice, but as long as you are trying to learn best practice, over time you will improve, and likely easier than just reading tutorials, because you are in control of what and how you do something.
Wait, I Shouldn't Re-invent the Wheel Though
Well, firstly, you cannot reinvent the wheel, it is impossible, as you will just make a wheel.
When people say "Don't reinvent the wheel", they of course mean "there are already frameworks out there", and to be fair, they are written by skilled developers.
That's not to say the frameworks don't have problems or issues, but in general they are pretty solid, secure and well written.
But the statement is nonsensical in relation to writing your own framework!
Writing your own framework for learning purposes is really useful.
Even if you plan to use it commercially, or for your own website, you haven't just "re-invented the wheel", you've made something else.
Your framework won't be like the others, it won't have many features and functionality, which might be a major advantage to you!
As long as you understand about best security practices etc, because you can think you are writing a great system, which is super fast and without all the bloat other frameworks have, but in fact you have holes in places which someone could crawl into...
But a project for learning which you don't use on the internet is ideal - or use it, eventually, when you are advanced enough to know it's secure!
With all that said, you should write your own framework IF:
You are not needing it any time soon! It takes a lot of time as
there are so many aspects to consider, learn, and trial and error
leads to refactoring (a lot at first!)
You are willing to read, code, test, change, read, code, and read
some more. There is a lot of good advice on the internet for advanced
PHP, most of it mind blowing at first, like reading all the design
patterns. But they eventually make sense, and end up helping you
resolve problems you face, and how to do things within your
framework.
Willing to put the time in, and keep trying to improve, and head
towards best practice, especially with security. Speed issues shouldn't be an issue with a small framework, and besides, if you have a fairly decent system, you can usually refactor and make speed improvements. usually if you have significant speed issues it means you've chosen intensive operations, which can usually be addressed by doing it a different way.
.
Without previous experience, or an advanced knowledge of PHP, you will likely spend some time writing a framework, further reading and knowledge will show you that your approach is skewed, and so you might delete everything and start again.
Don't be disheartened by this.
I did exactly that, as I learned so much advanced patterns and ways of doing things along the way in the first month, I ended up where refactoring was no good, and a blank canvas with a whole new approach was the only option.
However, this was quite pleasing, as I saw a much better structure take form, and I could see not only a better framework foundation start to take place, but realised it was because I had a better understanding of advanced PHP.
Just do it! Just make sure you have a plan of what you want it to do before you even write some code.
Seriously, write down on paper how you are going to load error checking, are you going to have auto loading, or include files when needed? Are you going to have a centralised loading mechanism, which instantiates classes when you need them, or some other method?
Whatever you do, and whatever stage you are at, if you are heading into new territory, plan it first. You'll be glad of it when you hit a brick wall, can go back to your plans, and realise a slight deviation to your plans will resolve it.
Otherwise you just end up with a mess and no plan or way to re-deign it to resolve the current problem or requirement you face.
You are looking to build exactly same thing I've worked on for a few years and the result is Agile Toolkit.
Very easy CRUD page generation
$page->add('CRUD')->setModel('User');
AJAX based pagination
All pagination and many other things are implemented through a native support for AJAX and Object Reloading. Below code shows a themed button with random label. Button is reloaded if clicked showing new number.
$b=$page->add('Button')->setLabel(rand(1,50));
$b->js('click')->reload();
Ajax based form validation if possible, or very easy form validation
All form validations is AJAX based. Response from server is a JavaScript chain which instructs browser to either highlight and display error message or to redirect to a next page or perform any other javascript action.
Sortable tables
Table sorting and pagination has a very intuitive and simple implementation when you can really on object reloading.
Ability to edit HTML templates using PHP
This seems out of place and a wrong thing to do. Templates are better of in the VCS.
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The question has been asked: No PHP for large projects? Why not? It's a recurring theme and PHP developers--with some cause--are forced to defend PHP.
All of these questions are valid and there have been some responses but this got me thinking. Based on the principle that you can write good code in any language and bad code in any language, I thought it worth asking a positive rather than negative question. Rather than why you can't, I wanted to ask how you can use PHP for large projects.
So, how do you write a large, complex, scalable, secure and robust PHP application?
EDIT: While I appreciate that the organizational aspects are important, they apply to any large project. What I'm primarily aiming for here is technical guidance and how to deal with common issues of scalability. Using an opcode cache like APC is an obvious starter. Cluster-aware sessions would be another. That's the sort of thing I'm getting at.
For the most part, the problems with php are not so much with the language. The problems come from the coupling of a low barrier of entry and the lack of any infrastructure to avoid common programming problems or security problems. Its a language that, by itself, is pretty quick-and-dirty. Nevertheless, it still has many advantages for large-scale web apps. You'll just need to know how to add in some level of infrastructure to avoid a lot of the common web programming blunders. See - What should a developer know before building a public web site for help with this.
You need to learn about the reasons php can make your web app to be insecure or problematic and learn to mitigate those problems. You should learn about how to use php to securely access your database. You should learn about avoiding SQL injection. You should learn about evil things like register_globals and why you should never ever use them. In short, you should do your homework about your tool before just diving in for a real-world, large-scale, web app.
Once you are educated, it comes down to you'll probably want to build a framework or use a preexisting framework that will mitigate these problems. Popular frameworks include PEAR and Zend.
Also, useful questions that might help:
What should every php programmer know?
What should a developer know before building a public web site
Using PHP for large projects isn't different than with any other language. You need experience and knowledge in writing maintainable and extendable source code. You need to be aware of security pitfalls and performance concerns. You need to have researched your problem domain and be well familiar with it.
In the end, same as any other language - what you need are high-quality and well-motivated developers.
i know, this is a little out of date, but still, i'll tempt an answer ...
use Haxe/PHP ... i could delve into details ... but if you look at the language, its features, and the nice way the PHP API is encapsulated into something rather consistent, you will soon see, what PHPs problems are ... and also, you have all the benefits of Haxe in the end ...
edit: this was a serious answer ... Haxe/PHP automatically solves a lot of problems mentioned in the post flagged as answer ...
register_globals is turned off ... you get your parameters through the php.Web
using the SPOD-layer (same API for php) for the database automatically takes care of escaping (and will automatically provide your model (and templo is quite a good template engine, so that should help for your views))
having a typed language, you are more likely to write better code ... plus language features as generics and enums are very powerful ... and there is a lot of compile time magic in Haxe that is also of interest ... a more powerful language is always good to adress complex problems ...
if you want to use other PHP frameworks, you only need to write the external classes and everything will work as expected ...
i think Haxe is a very good answer to "large", "complex", "secure" and "robust" ... scalability does not come from Haxe itself of course ... but still, if you check out haxelib, then you find many things, that would help for scalability ... such as memcached (you will have to change neko.net.Socket to php.net.Socket in memcached.Connection) ...
if you really want to use the PHP language, and not just the platform, Haxe won't help you of course ...
You do as you would in any other language or any other enviornment.
There are a couple of simple steps in project development:
Organization; You need to organize everything, having documentation, uml diagrams and other pre-work done, before you start programming.
Structure; Before you start coding and also aftter starting, you need to have a focus on structure, meaning that you always need to do it correctly and not do any spagetthi solutions. Keep code simple and well commented.
These two points, are simple and apply in all development areas, despite the language. Keep it simple and well documented and you will find that developing a large scale web app in PHP is as easy as it would be in ASP.NET, Ruby or whatever.
However when we come to the development stage, you need to get a nice IDE, use a good database, use a repo., get an MVC / Template system, this runs in the "Structure"-part though.
Just as a side point, splitting the application into different layers: DLF ( Data, Logic, Front ). Use at least these three layers and you will find that the development will go easy.
Use Model-View-Controller framework. It's been said, yes. And, have at least one engineer for each part.
Model: Your DBA should write the Model code. No should else should be allowed to write SQL statements.
View: The one with the best knowledge of CSS and Javascript should do the view part. He/she should write the least PHP code, he is the one using PHP variables.
Controller: She's the real PHP coder, and also back-end server engineer, hopefully, with or without using other script languages.