I've finally made a simple chat page that I had wanted to make for a while now, but I'm running into problems with my servers.
I'm not sure if long polling is the correct term, but from what I understand, I think it is. I have an ajax call to a php page that checks a mysql database for messages with times newer than the time sent in the ajax request. If there isn't a newer message, it keeps looping and checking until there is. Else, it just returns the new messages and the client script sends another ajax request as soon as it gets the messages.
Everything is working fine, except for the part where the server on 000webhost stops responding after a few chat messages, and the server on x10 hosting gives me a message about hitting a resource limit.
Maybe this is a dumb way to do a chat system, but it's all I know how to do. If there is a better way please let me know.
edit: Holy hell, it's just occurred to me that I didn't put any sleep time in the while loop on the server.
You can find a lot of reading on this, but I disbelieve that free web hosting is going to allow to do what you are thinking of doing. PHP was also not really designed to create chat systems.
I would recommend using WebSockets, and use for example, Node.JS with Socket.IO, or Tornado with Python; There is a lot of solutions out there, but most of them would require you to run your own server since it requires to run a whole program that interacts with many connections at once instead of simple scripts that just start and finish with a single connection.
What about using the same strategy whether there are newer messages on the server or not. The server would always return a list of newer messages - this list could be empty when there are no newer messages. The empty list could be also be encoded as a special data token.
The client then proceeds in both cases the same way: it processes the received data and requests new messages after a time period.
Make sure you sleep(1) your code on each loop, the code gonna enter the loop several times per second, stressing your database/server.
But still, nodejs or websockets are better tecnologies to deal with real time chats.
Related
I've been reading a lot on the subject of SSE and PHP, most of which seems to be advocating it as viable solutions for all sorts of things including chat apps. I have seen similar questions on this site but have not found a concise, definitive answer.
Is there something inherent in SSE which makes it way more server-friendly than AJAX short polling? Because the headers appear to be of very similar size. I am wondering if there is some kind of behind-the-scenes stuff beyond the headers that a noob like myself can't see e.g. some sort of connection recognition with each request/response? I know there are other factors involved where SSE prevails such as handling disconnections.
In terms of using it in a chat app scenario, ajax and sse appear to be doing the same thing. Neither of them seems to be able to perform long polling effectively with PHP. If I have User A and User B waiting on a PHP script that checks for new messages from the other user in the DB then sleeps for 3 seconds for say 10 loops, User A's new message cannot be inserted until User B has looped through the entire checking script, thereby rendering it absolutely useless (at least based on everything I've tried in the last 2 weeks!). I can get it working smoothly if I chat to myself and no one else is waiting on the checking script, but I've run out of things to talk about with myself and would really enjoy someone else being able to use it too.
So in a nutshell, given an Apache and PHP environment with WebSockets as not an option (due to shared hosting), is the only effective way to write a chat app, based on server burden alone, by short polling with one's choice of either AJAX or SSE, or is SSE definitely the superior option?
I would pursue WebSockets if the eventual traffic called for it and justified the web hosting upgrade.
(ALSO, as a side, is my premise off base regarding the long-polling scenario I described above where User A must wait for User B's loop to finish before he/she/it can perform the insert? Got me confused as to why that should be the case).
Kind of a long-winded, meandering question but hoping someone in the same situation can find this question and save themselves a lot of time.
Many Thanks!
Yes, SSE is a better option than AJAX, as AJAX polling is done on the main servers, like where most of the normal user traffic is to be hit. Whereas SSE polling is done on another instance which is made for it, so there will be no extra traffic on the main server. Please check Mercure (https://mercure.rocks/)
EDIT:
I mean to that, using SSE with platforms like Mercure would be a better option than AJAX. As AJAX will make a request to the main server. Which would increase the count of requests for the main server. Whereas we can distribute the network load using tools like the Mercure, in order to achieve the required functionality.
SSE can be thought of a thin API wrapper around the AJAX long-poll approach. It brings a standard API to something that was a hacky solution before.
something inherent in SSE which makes it way more server-friendly than AJAX short polling?
It holds the socket open. The pro of this is less latency (as soon as the server has the new information it sends it to the client, rather than waiting for the next client poll); the con is the extra resource usage (the socket, and the PHP process).
but I've run out of things to talk about with myself
Surely not. Have you tried starting a chat about if time is an illusion, and what came before?
with WebSockets as not an option (due to shared hosting)
SSE and WebSockets both hold a socket open. Shared hosting ISPs often go round closing sockets that have been open a long time (e.g. over 60s), unless they explicitly say they support SSE. The may also kill long-running PHP processes.
is my premise off base regarding the long-polling scenario I described above where User A must wait for User B's loop to finish before he/she/it can perform the insert?
I think it is off. The "A" in Ajax is asynchronous, meaning you can have multiple ajax/sse requests running at the same time. And on the server side you will have a distinct PHP process running for each request.
I have started to study SSE and I found an example with php chat application (http://www.developphp.com/video/JavaScript/Server-Sent-Events-Simple-Chat-Application-Example).
The video shows that the messages are not delayed. But when I tried the example on my own server (WAMP) I have a very long delay to the point that it is no longer a real-time application as it claims. I found that if I changed the retry:15000 to a value much much smaller (for example 100 millisecond) only then getting near real-time. But this is not good. This is polling and not truly real-time application. It seems that after each message the connection to the server is lost and resets accordingly to retry. It doesn't seem like a very smart application because we have not avoided constant requests from client to server like plain Ajax polling.
Thanks
It seems that we have to make an infinity loop to the server side code to keep connection opened with only one request. But this makes no sense because we turn again to old plain polling!! Or we have to write code that is synchronous waiting for something in each iteration like, for this particular example, an update of the chat.txt file.
Ok, I am working up something like a chat environment, and I'd like to have near real time if not real time conversation. But I know browsers will only give up 2 threads at a time for transactions per domain. So I am trying to figure out a way to make a synchronous chat without really effecting the browser. I also know browsers tend to lock up with synchronous requests.
So whats the best approach at creating a chat like environment on a site from scratch, assume the DB and scripting concept is fine, its the managing of the connection, wondering how to keep a persistant connection that won't congest the browser and cause it to possibly freeze up.
Anyone have any ideas.. Im not looking for flash, or java based solutions. I'd prefer not to poll every second either. But what is stacks impression, what would you do.
First off, the spec only suggests that two connections are allowed. Most modern browsers actually support up to 6.
There're three main accepted methods for creating a chat system out of pure Javascript:
Polling
The first solution is simple, and just involves polling the server every few seconds (5 is a nice number) to see what it's missed. It works simply and efficiently, but can lead to large amounts of unnecessary requests if not careful, which can cause unnecessary server load.
A better implementation of this involves polling to simply check if anything's happened since the last chat update, and if so, only then go through the process of finding out what's happened. Saves on the server load and bandwidth fronts.
Waiting
This method's more commonly used, and involves the browser sending a request to the server which is never fulfilled, and instead keeps 'waiting for a response'. When something happens, the server outputs it and fulfills the request, and the client makes another request and the process repeats. This saves on the request front, but can end up with a backlog of ongoing processes on your server.
Websockets
https://developer.mozilla.org/en/WebSockets
This involves creating a direct socket connection to the server, allowing data to be pushed to the client when needed. It's relatively new though, and can have some compatability issues, especially with older browsers.
Out of these, none of them is specifically the 'best method'; it depends on what you're aiming for, and what matters. If you've got a site designed for up-to-date browsers, then websockets could be your answer, but if you've got a small-ish server, then polling could be better, for example.
My own chat engine checks for new messages every five seconds. That's close enough to instant that nobody knows the difference.
It's as simple as setInterval(updateChat,5000);.
I've got a small php web app I put together to automate some manual processes that were tedious and time consuming. The app is pretty much a GUI that ssh's out and "installs" software to target machines based off of atomic change #'s from source control (perforce if it matters). The app currently kicks off each installation in a new popup window. So, say I'm installing software to 10 different machines, I get 10 different pop ups. This is getting to be too much. What are my options for kicking these processes off and displaying the results back on one page?
I was thinking I could have one popup that dynamically created divs for every installation I was kicking off, and do an ajax call for each one then display the output for each install in the corresponding div. The only problem is, I don't know how I can kick these processes off in parallel. It'll take way too long if I have to wait for each one to go out, do it's thing, and spit the results back. I'm using jQuery if it helps, but I'm looking mainly for high level architecture ideas atm. Code examples are welcome, but psuedo code is just fine.
I don't know how advanced you are or even if you have root access to your server which would be required, but this is one possible way.. it uses several different technologies, and would probably be suited for a large scale application rather than a small. But I'll advise you on it anyway.
Following technologies/stacks are used (in addition to PHP as you mentioned):
WebSockets (on top of node.js)
JSON-RPC Server (within node.js)
Gearman
What you would do, is from your client (so via JavaScript), when the page loads, a connection is made to node.js via WebSockets ) you can use something like socket.io for this).
Then when you decide that you want to do a task, (which might take a long time...) you send a request to your server, this might be some JSON encoded raw body, or it might just be a simple GET /do/something. What is important is what happens next.
On your server, when the job is received, you kick off a new job to Gearman, by adding a Task to your server. This then processes your task, and it will be a non blocking request, so you can respond immediately back to the client who made the request saying "hey we are processing your job".
Then, your server with all of your Gearman workers, receives the job, and starts processing it. This might take 5 minutes lets say for arguments sake. Once it has finished, the worker then makes a JSON encoded message which it sends to your node.js server which receives it via JSON-RPC.
After it grabs the message, it can then emit the event to any connections which need to know about it via websockets.
I needed something like this for a project once and managed to learn the basics of node.js in a day (having already a strong JS background). The second day I was complete with a full push/pull messaging job notification platform.
How can I write a real time chat using XAJAX and PHP?
In other words, is there a way to send xajax responses from the server to multiple clients?
Or is the only possibility to check for new messages every few seconds on client side?
No. Clients must "poll" the server repeatadly.
I think the key here is to think interaction design. The trick is to fool the user into thinking that the chat is instant, but when in reality it updates once every 1 or 2 or 3 or 10 seconds.
Ideas:
1) When the user sends a message, show it directly in the chat and trigger a poll.
2) If a poll comes back with multiple messages from other users, don't add them all at once, actually add them over a period of 1-2 sec or so, with random spacing, making it look like they're coming in "instantly" and independently. (If a bunch of messages come in at once the user is very quick to realize that the chat updated there and then, and not continiously.)
3) If the user is idle for x amount of time. Drop the poll rate to once every 10sec or so.
4) If the user is active, ie sending a lot of messages, poll more often.
5) Have a static file for every channel that your write the time the chat last updated to. For instance file chat-teenfun-lastupdate.txt has the contents 1224934239 or whatever time format you prefer. Serve this file statically and let clients poll this file in order to check if the channel has updated, rather that calling chat-poll.php?ch=teenfun that does a dynamic check. Static files are served around 10-100 times faster, depending on the work involved for the dynamic script, and you're gonna need it when you get 250+ users polling.
Good luck and have fun!
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PS. Alternatively you could actually let clients do an ajax call to the server and keep them 'hanging'. That is you accept their request and pretend to start sending data back, but then you just pause. When something happends you finish the response with the approriate data. For this to work I believe you'd need to write your own HTTP-server though, that does this specifically, as you can't have 250 php processes hanging around in memory. Maybe Lighttpd could be used in this way somehow with that LUA cache mod. I don't know. Would be interesting though. Hell I gotta try it sometime :)
Sure there is, but I don't think it'll be very efficient with many users. You can either do polling where each client polls the server to see if there are any new messages, or you could use the comet technique in which the server can push new messages to the clients - Check out the Comet plugin for XAJAX. How this would be implemented using XAJAX and PHP is beyond me, but here's how I would try to implement it.
Let each client connect to the server (login etc), then:
For each message sent by a client (sender) update the message queue for client (receiver)
Let client poll server for new messages in the queue / Push the new messages via comet.
Update GUI if there are new messages.
Rinse, lather, repeat
Using a true IM server like ejabberd could go a long way, be more efficient and allow your users to connect via desktop clients (if that's what you want). I'd probably use that as a backend, IOW ejabberd would be the server and PHP would be the client using XMPP in PHP, and act as a proxy for the webgui.
See also:
Google Techtalk on Gmail's chat feature (and scalability issues)
That's my $0.02
As long as there there is not HTTP push technology you will never get a realtime chat only using JavaScript.
Possible workarrounds:
use a Flash Movie or a Java Applet to perform some socket communication
hold polling requests back on the server side for a few seconds
You could use websockets, but being a new HTML5 feature it's kinda limited. Lucky for you there is socksjs, which implements websockets on browsers that do not handle it.
On the hosting side you should be able to use any websockets server, there's a few for PHP.
If you are looking to implement a chat server written with a scripting language such as PHP/JSP, technique of hanging HTTP connection will have to be ticked off from your your options list. The reason is most of the web severs (specially shared hosts) don't like too many connections hanging.
You can find everything you need to implement a web client and PHP chat server in this "Optimized Chat Server Protocol for Server Side Scripting Languages" publication.
The best strategy I've seen is to do an AJAX request for messages and then restart that exact same request as soon as it finishes.
On the server side, make the script "stall" for 60 seconds or until a new message is received. This keeps the same connection open for a max of 60 seconds, but when a new message is received, it outputs it and stops immediately, prompting the client-side AJAX to open another connection.
This provides almost instant notification of new messages and is also much easier on the server than making a new connection every x seconds.