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So i've been playing around with php the past month. I know how to create a basic dynamic webpage with PHP, i can apply CRUD to my web pages and i can create my own simple login-scripts.
Now i want to get into a PHP Framework, but i'm not sure if my php skills are good enough to start working with a framework. Or should i just play around more with standard php?
I'm afraid that when starting with a framework to early, you can only know a small part about it, and you don't understand completely what is happening behind the framework.
Can someone share their experience with this?
If you have learned basic Object Oriented Programming concepts (OOP) and understand them, you are ready. If you don't know what that means, then you are still probably writing procedural-only code. Frameworks will be using OOP so you will be off to a bad start if you can't even understand the syntax.
If you understand OOP, maybe start with CodeIgniter. It's pretty simple as far as frameworks go.
What you create with the framework might not be pretty, efficient, or the code of an experience programmer, but it will introduce you to dozens of new concepts and aspects of coding that you hadn't even thought about or knew existed. You will learn about the underlying architecture of an application, MVC, how to structure your code, etc.
I think it is beneficial to push yourself. In my experience, this is how you excel. Otherwise you stagnate, stuck with your old-fashioned, beginner knowledge.
You sound like you want to learn, and sound like you are capable of teaching yourself, so just dive in and see what you can do. Give it a few months and you will probably know CodeIgniter well and wonder how you ever built websites without frameworks of some kind.
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I start this topic saying that I use PHP since 2014 and I'm experienced with it, but recently (yesterday) I started to give a look to NodeJS.
Node is growing fast and it's been used by a lot of web-services.
I started using it yesterday, but I found it less "beginner-user friendly" than PHP.
I'm not saying this as a beginner in computer programming, but as a Node-beginner.
What is your opinion?
Is it worth knowing both languages?
Is it worth knowing both languages ?
If you come from php development, learning node is a great idea.
It ll teach you in a soft way the concurrent programming pattern, and also event/stream programming,
it will lead you to face problems regarding the underlying OS in a soft way.
All sort of stuff that PHP greatly solves for you right out of the box and which you never think about.
Node will also give you the impression of a bigger playground to explore.
But, if you want to be productive when it s about building website, i believe PHP is better.
On the other hand, if you are looking for performance, node may be better, but true performance comes with compiled languages like GO, not scripted languages.
Finally, if php was not plumbed by all those damn heavy javaesque framework, it would be a really nice environment with a good trade off between speed and complexity.
Node gives you speed, but it comes with a price about the complexity which can be very costly.
As a beginner of both language i noted the following advantages of both languages
PHP
Mixing code with content
Deep code base
No client app needed
SQL
Speed of coding
NodeJs
Separating concerns
Newer code means more modern features
Service calls are thinner than HTML-fat PHP calls
JSON
Raw speed
You can read full article Here
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I want to learn to create and modify php applications. I learned most of the common syntax by now and understand basic concepts like connecting to mysql and post and get http methods, but still not sure how to go about creating something complex like a full application with libraries and how it all connects together. I tried analyzing already existing apps and get really confused just by looking at codes that call on other files with many custom functions which are unreadable to my eyes. I hear about frameworks and about libraries, but I am pretty confused in this step of the way. What would be the concept I am missing to learn to make the leap towards creating complex applications. Any help will be appreciated.
There is always a lot to learn with php. It's a constant learning curve.
Some of the things that I can let you know.
Firstly make sure you follow best practices. There is always the temptation to cut corners, because php allows it.
Here is a guide to coding with php the right way which I found useful
http://www.phptherightway.com/
There are many php frameworks out there these days and choosing the right one that fits your needs is important. Some are more powerful or flexible than other, but some also have a steeper learning curve than others.
http://www.hongkiat.com/blog/best-php-frameworks/
Article that may help. Most of the frameworks will have a "how to" which will guide you through the process.
I personally use ZF2, but Laravel has gained a lot of popularity these days.
Also make sure you take a look at some of the places like tutsplus, project treehouse and other great learning resources.
Good luck, and I hope you make some amazing applications.
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I am starting a new challenge. I am on my way to learn PHP since (I already have good knowledge in HTML CSS), i would like to have you advise in a good procedure of learning this.
To be specific my final goal is to be a very developer in PHP by the end of 2015 and able to work on project on my own and/or with team as freelancer.
I would like to hear from you guys a step by step learning programs which will conduct me to have confirmed knowledge in PHP OOP and Framework Symphony2. As i don't want to skip the stages i'd like your advise :
I have basic understanding of (loop, if/else, function).
I am looking some course (updated) and exercise to push up my level slowly but efficiency. A list of step would be a great start.
I'd suggest that you ensure that have a solid understanding of generic programming principles before you focus on a specific language. Knowing markup languages like HTML is relatively easy in comparison. When you get to programming, there's a lot more things to consider.
There's plenty of available free resources that should be able to help you.
http://www.tutorialspoint.com/computer_programming/
welcome to SO. There are lots of resources out there, some easier than others for a beginner. I would start on something like code academy and augment that with resources like php.net.
Then when youve covered those tutorials (I would do all the markup stuff like HTML as well) think of a personal project and build it. Its all very well reading manuals and doing tutorials, but you need a real live project to force you into finding solutions for real debugging issues. That cant really be taught.
Its worth noting that PHP isnt the only server side language out there, so keep an open mind and be ready to investigate other avenues as you find them.
Bear in mind to be able to hold your own in the industry is very different from being able to handle your personal projects ok. There are a lot more variables (no pun intended) in industry and the skillset you need to have is often wider.
Good luck with it.
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I'm new to PHP and am trying to more of an overview before I jump into the code sometime tomorrow.
What advantage does using a framework like CodeIgniter or CakePHP or Zend provide over using 'plain vanilla' PHP?
The framework takes care of the stuff that everyone's done a hundred times - authenticating users, talking to databases, handling file uploads, validating forms.
It saves you time, because you don't have to write it again.
It saves you headaches, because it's probably designed better than you would off the cuff and because it's already been thoroughly debugged.
It makes it easier to collaborate, because anyone who knows the framework has a step up on understanding your program.
It makes programming more fun, because you can focus on writing the interesting bits, not the slugwork.
Any framework has the advantage of solving problems that just about any programmer would encounter without using a framework.
There are many common problems that you and I would face regardless of whether or not we're building software for banking, media, news, etc, and instead of reinventing the wheel, you can springboard off of the hundreds and thousands of hours of developer experience by using code that has been tried and tested in a multitude of different production environments.
The motto is this: Don't reinvent the wheel. Your job is to meet a business goal, not solve problems that other people have already solved for you.
One advantage is: Design decisions are made for you.
One disadvantage is: Design decisions are made for you.
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Hi sorry if this is a naive question, but what did people do before mvc frameworks became so popular? All you hear of nowadays, and im talking php here, are mvc, Zend etc but what did developers do beforehand?
Are there some developers who use the mvc pattern but without a framework - if so how do they do this and is it really complicated to set up?
MVC is a design pattern. You can easily roll your own MVC "framework" (technically even without using object-oriented programming). The main goal is simply to have a separation between data storage, business logic, and presentation.
When I was first learning about MVC, I decided that trying to sift through the mountains of code of CakePHP or other frameworks was simply too complicated. I started writing my own "framework" using this tutorial (http://fuelyourcoding.com/php-frameworks-just-roll-your-own-part-1/). It's really not as much work as you think (you can go through that tutorial in a day and have a very nice mini-MVC), and you can expand it later into a full-fledged framework later on if you have the time and dedication.
As to the question of what developers did before frameworks, well, they just wrote everything themselves. Unfortunately this led to a lot of spaghetti code with HTML mixed with PHP blocks and SQL statements, but that's not really a fault with not having a framework, rather with not trying to implement any sort of separation of concerns.
Edit: Part 2 is probably the most important part because it shows you how to make a template. This isn't actually the exact tutorial, the one I used seems to have disappeared.